This sonnet makes me think of both my parents and my late maternal grandparents. Neither my grandmother nor my mother were conventionally beautiful in their youth. My mother describes herself as "plain". My grandmother used to console my mother lamenting her lack of looks by saying, "Some of the plainest girls get some of the handsomest husbands." It was true for both of them, as my grandfather and my father were very handsome according to conventional standards. My mother loves to recount how when my father first paid her compliments, he said he liked a facial feature that she had thought was completely unattractive. My grandfather, on meeting my grandmother at a dinner, is rumoured to have stared so long and hard at her that she finally kicked him under the table (the rumour is entirely believable - my grandfather had intense blue eyes that stare from every photograph we have of him and my grandmother had gumption and a wicked sense of humour). My grandparents were happily married for nearly six decades until my grandfather's death, and my parents are rapidly approaching the five decade mark.
When I read that passage in Proverbs 5:15-19, "Rejoice with the wife of thy youth", I think of their examples. That is why the incel movement and similar movements (i.e. certain social media influencers) within younger male circles are so horrifying to women of mine and the next generation . The misguided males in these circles are so obsessed with imaginary standards of sexual attractiveness that they cannot see what men of former generation, such as my father and grandfather saw, that you will find all the beauty you desire in the woman you commit to love and cherish for life. If you aren't willing to lay your ideals and your ego down to cherish a real woman, then you cannot expect any woman to risk her life with you.
This is amazing, Holly. I love this story and thank you for sharing it.
I went to Ireland many years ago in college, and I remember being struck by seeing couples in public who weren’t well-matched in physical beauty. In the terms of those days, I would have said a “10” with a “7” or some such thing. You know what I mean. That kind of pairing in America was something I never saw, and I remember thinking: imagine seeing physical beauty as just one feature or quality in a person, just one in a vast array of qualities. That’s how it seemed to me in watching these couples and it seemed so good and right. Something still rare in America. (I hope this story makes sense!)
Karen, it totally makes sense. One reason we loved watching British literary productions as teens, like the 1995 'Pride and Predjudice', was because the actors looked like real people, not screen idols. Sometimes, you would think, first seeing an actor in a lead romantic role and think, "But they aren't beautiful/handsome" and by the end of the miniseries you were convinced they were beautiful/handsome. It taught me that there are many ways of being beautiful, not just the current pop/movie star iteration.
Showing my ignorance, I read the opening line and thought, Hey that sounds like an album! And indeed it is - Sting's 1987 album, his 2nd solo offering, goes under the title, Nothing Like The Sun. The nod to Shakespeare might have been lost on me but not for the Rolling Stone reviewer at the time who said, "Against the extravagant imagery of much Elizabethan love poetry, that sonnet articulates a human-scale vision of love for a flesh-and-blood woman who, far from standing on a pedestal, “treads on the ground.” Similarly, on … Nothing Like the Sun, Sting resists, for the most part, his tendency to drift into the mystic. Instead he locates the LP’s songs in an uneasy three-dimensional world of unruly emotions (“Be Still My Beating Heart,” “Sister Moon”), nightmarish social systems (“History Will Teach Us Nothing,” “They Dance Alone”) and personal commitment (“The Secret Marriage”)." Might make for an interesting listen in light of what we've seen here.
It seems as though Shakespeare himself used vivid imagery (albeit perhaps not clichéd) in his sonnets (indeed, as we've seen here), so is this a slice of wit partly at his own expense, as well as challenging his readers to avoid idealising their lover in ways that cannot be sustained and deprecating what is normal, instead affirming that love has to be both earthed and earthy?
Well, I would draw a sharper distinction between imagery in general and cliched metaphors. Shakespeare used lots of fresh and arresting imagery—and some cliches, too, to be sure.
But he is certainly having fun with himself and all poets here.
Thanks for the shoutout for my note/question. Thinking about the nature of beauty as we age, this sonnet fits in nicely with "love is not love which alters when it alteration finds."
I'm reading Madame Bovary right now. 19th century version of Instagram-provoked desire for surface things
Also, thanks to Matt Franck for kindly pointing out to me that it’s not my gander that’s up but my dander! 😂 I will edit it later.
But really, what’s good for the goose is good for the gander!
And there was me thinking it was just some bizarre Americanism..... ;)
🤣
This sonnet makes me think of both my parents and my late maternal grandparents. Neither my grandmother nor my mother were conventionally beautiful in their youth. My mother describes herself as "plain". My grandmother used to console my mother lamenting her lack of looks by saying, "Some of the plainest girls get some of the handsomest husbands." It was true for both of them, as my grandfather and my father were very handsome according to conventional standards. My mother loves to recount how when my father first paid her compliments, he said he liked a facial feature that she had thought was completely unattractive. My grandfather, on meeting my grandmother at a dinner, is rumoured to have stared so long and hard at her that she finally kicked him under the table (the rumour is entirely believable - my grandfather had intense blue eyes that stare from every photograph we have of him and my grandmother had gumption and a wicked sense of humour). My grandparents were happily married for nearly six decades until my grandfather's death, and my parents are rapidly approaching the five decade mark.
When I read that passage in Proverbs 5:15-19, "Rejoice with the wife of thy youth", I think of their examples. That is why the incel movement and similar movements (i.e. certain social media influencers) within younger male circles are so horrifying to women of mine and the next generation . The misguided males in these circles are so obsessed with imaginary standards of sexual attractiveness that they cannot see what men of former generation, such as my father and grandfather saw, that you will find all the beauty you desire in the woman you commit to love and cherish for life. If you aren't willing to lay your ideals and your ego down to cherish a real woman, then you cannot expect any woman to risk her life with you.
This is amazing, Holly. I love this story and thank you for sharing it.
I went to Ireland many years ago in college, and I remember being struck by seeing couples in public who weren’t well-matched in physical beauty. In the terms of those days, I would have said a “10” with a “7” or some such thing. You know what I mean. That kind of pairing in America was something I never saw, and I remember thinking: imagine seeing physical beauty as just one feature or quality in a person, just one in a vast array of qualities. That’s how it seemed to me in watching these couples and it seemed so good and right. Something still rare in America. (I hope this story makes sense!)
Karen, it totally makes sense. One reason we loved watching British literary productions as teens, like the 1995 'Pride and Predjudice', was because the actors looked like real people, not screen idols. Sometimes, you would think, first seeing an actor in a lead romantic role and think, "But they aren't beautiful/handsome" and by the end of the miniseries you were convinced they were beautiful/handsome. It taught me that there are many ways of being beautiful, not just the current pop/movie star iteration.
YES!!! 🥹
This is brilliant- a romantic short story in one comment
"How much sweeter to be seen—truly seen—and loved anyway?"
The glorious truth is that this is how God loves us.
Exactly. ☺️
Showing my ignorance, I read the opening line and thought, Hey that sounds like an album! And indeed it is - Sting's 1987 album, his 2nd solo offering, goes under the title, Nothing Like The Sun. The nod to Shakespeare might have been lost on me but not for the Rolling Stone reviewer at the time who said, "Against the extravagant imagery of much Elizabethan love poetry, that sonnet articulates a human-scale vision of love for a flesh-and-blood woman who, far from standing on a pedestal, “treads on the ground.” Similarly, on … Nothing Like the Sun, Sting resists, for the most part, his tendency to drift into the mystic. Instead he locates the LP’s songs in an uneasy three-dimensional world of unruly emotions (“Be Still My Beating Heart,” “Sister Moon”), nightmarish social systems (“History Will Teach Us Nothing,” “They Dance Alone”) and personal commitment (“The Secret Marriage”)." Might make for an interesting listen in light of what we've seen here.
Wow! That is quite a find/connection! Thank you, Richard.
It seems as though Shakespeare himself used vivid imagery (albeit perhaps not clichéd) in his sonnets (indeed, as we've seen here), so is this a slice of wit partly at his own expense, as well as challenging his readers to avoid idealising their lover in ways that cannot be sustained and deprecating what is normal, instead affirming that love has to be both earthed and earthy?
Well, I would draw a sharper distinction between imagery in general and cliched metaphors. Shakespeare used lots of fresh and arresting imagery—and some cliches, too, to be sure.
But he is certainly having fun with himself and all poets here.
Thanks Karen, that's helpful. I WAS rather miserly in suggesting his imagery is "perhaps not clichéd"!!
Cliches become such but don't begin as such. I think one reason people don't really read Romeo and Juliet is that they are too familiar with it.
Karen.
Thanks for the shoutout for my note/question. Thinking about the nature of beauty as we age, this sonnet fits in nicely with "love is not love which alters when it alteration finds."
I'm reading Madame Bovary right now. 19th century version of Instagram-provoked desire for surface things
Looking forward to the Marlowe.
Oh, I hope you write about Madame Bovary! One of my absolute favorite novels. So good to have you here!
This sonnet makes me think of a line from Springsteen’s song Thunder Road: So you’re scared and you’re thinking
That maybe we ain’t that young anymore
Show a little faith, there’s magic in the night
You ain’t a beauty but hey you’re all right
Oh and that’s all right with me